SeoulPodcast #61: Eat Your Kimchi

Jun 30, 2009 by

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PANELISTS
Simon and Martina Stawski (Eat Your Kimchi)

MAIN TOPIC

A Short History of Expat Video Blogs in Korea

“Miguk” (2000) – The first English teacher documentary in Korea

“Autumn in Korea” (2004) – ZenKimchi

Mongdori (2006)

Annalog (2007)

Eat Your Kimchi (2008)

NEWS AND STUFF

Whither the Kang Nam, North Korea’s suspect cargo ship? | csmonitor.com

Three Arrested Under National Security Law

Korean War Anniversary Celebrated

 

Grandma Removed From Life Support Under Ruling

 

W50,000 Bills Shift Transaction Culture

“I actually felt the urge to purchase more and max out to 50,000 won.”

 

THINGS THAT MAKE YOU GO WHAA?

GNP Presses MBC Chief to Step Down

US Beef Being Driven Out of Department Stores

Police issue summons to political cartoonist in Wonju for insulting LMB.

Roh altar taken down in vigilante action

First-person: Roh Memorial torn down

Mentally ill woman faced persecution in Korea, gets refugee status in Canada.

More Nazi Imagery in Korea

Mixed-Koreans with “distinct skin colors” exempt from mandatory military service.

Japanese police arrest head of late actress Jang Ja-yeon’s management agency

I Was Wondering Why They Didn’t Work…

x-ray glasses… I thought only naive kids bought those

Heat wave warning for Jeollanam-do.

So let’s play at the sewage water treatment plant!

Sewage plant playground of water

Korean Government to Promote Bicycle Usage

Chairman of the Presidential Committee on National Competitiveness wants to tinker with romanization.

NHRC: Many Textbooks Are Discriminatory

Report: Korean Kindergarten Teachers Underpaid, Overworked

We coulda told you that

Students to Receive Psychiatric Evaluation

Two caught helping others cheat on TOEIC via wireless devices

Pharmacology Students Caught Cheating at SNU

EXPAT COMMUNITY

>From Matt Robinson:
I am offically leaving to go back to the USA tomorrow morning. I will be going to the Cleveland Clinic on Monday the 29th, and hopefully this will lead me back to full health once again. Since March 1st, when I had my first surgery, so many people have helped me through these tough times.
I am in good spirits and have plenty of hope because of this.
So many people have helped that I don't even know so for those of you who have remained anonymous...thank you.
There are many also that need to be acknowledged: Paul Hussey  (Global Village Center), Kim Mi-Ju (Joong Ang Daily), The students at Suwon Foreign Language High School, Alexandria, Phillies, HBC, VFW, Seoul Players, Bundang Social Club, Aussie Bar, Berlin, Indigo/Orange Tree, Stompers, Eden, Big Rock, Dr. John Linton & Severance Hospital...if I have forgetten anyone I apologize.
I also have to pay my respects to all my friends, old and new, that visited in the hospital and brought me food and entertainment. Those who spent time organizing the different events and fundraising efforts.
Leaving Korea like this is very difficult, but I realize that it is the only necessary option for me right now. Once again you have all helped so much and I can never truly express my gratitude, or maybe I am now...I don't know. I hope that you all continue to enjoy your time in Korea and I hope in time maybe I'll see many of you here again at some point because I am not getting to leave on my own terms. I will miss you all, but I will update this sight on my recovery process.

Wagner rips Anti-English Spectrum a New One

Abandon discriminatory HIV policy

Wagner’s piece

Anti-English Spectrum’s attempts to link English teachers to AIDS

Just how much influence does Anti-English Spectrum have?

The Illogic and Bad Methodology of Lee Eun-ung and the “Anti-English Spectrum” People

 

Teachers Running Rampant

Jason Lim’s piece

Yet Another Foreign Male Predator Story

Silly, silly stuff

Reporter: Foreign Men Are Targeting Our Women

An Open Letter to Flower Boys

KMK: “You have royally screwed up my Gaydar”

Korea to Toughen Rules on International Marriages

Gov’t wants tighter rules on getting citizenship – INSIDE JoongAng Daily

Soldiers Rescue Girl at Haeundae Beach In Busan

 

 

Paul Ajosshi: When is a Steak not a Steak?

WTF??? Country fried steak is BEEF, not pork. Avoid Isabella’s.

 

PLUGS
Buy Us a Beer

The Suppliers
(those who have given us swag)

John Kim
Aaron Shearin

Lives of the Party
(those who have donated at least $20)
Robin Hudson
Stephanie White
Aaron Shearin
Naomi Neckoway
Chae An
Kevin R.
Otto Silver

Drinking Buddies
(those who have bought us beers)
Mary Campbell
Mimi Snider
Elton Fry
Therese MacSeain

Toast to Absent Friends

GoToMyPC
Ex-Pat Living (The Korea Herald)
ESL Planet Recruiting
Fan us on Facebook
SEOUL Magazine
ZenKimchi.com
The Chosun Bimbo
KOTESOL


MUSIC
Main Theme — Ben McPherson – “2wksnyc”
News — satya – “Silk Route Album Mix”
Things That Make You Go Whaa? — cjacks – “Candyland”
ExPat Community — Deyo – “Retro90210fun”
Adam Schmitt
Anomie Enemy
Blue Valentine
Circle in a Square
Jack Jeffery
Kaveh
Lee Douglas
Chi Weapon
Devin Anderson
Celtic Fusion

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  • ketchupsic

    ..Please don’t spread false ideas. The so called “nazi imagery” seen in the marine outfit on Girls Generation member Sooyoung is not affiliated with nazis at all. That pin is an old-time brand in Korea which does NOT have a swastika. It says S2 if you zoom on it.

  • ketchupsic

    ..Please don’t spread false ideas. The so called “nazi imagery” seen in the marine outfit on Girls Generation member Sooyoung is not affiliated with nazis at all. That pin is an old-time brand in Korea which does NOT have a swastika. It says S2 if you zoom on it.

  • Kevin Robinson

    Hey guys, I just want to quickly comment on your AFEK comments in the podcast. I’ve talked with a lot of them, and apart from their stance on ATEK, I’ve found them to be quite nice and good guys and gals. I completely disagree with many of them about ATEK (I’m not the only one I think), so I simply don’t talk about that and avoid that part of the forums.

    Overall, the forums there are about development both professionally and privately. I’ve learned about their families, their experiences with schools or travel, and lots more.

    Basically, I don’t think your comments were completely accurate.

    • http://zenkimchi.com/ Joe

      Well, to be fair, I should have qualified that with “if” they did it then it was low. I got the info from two separate sources, saw the post on Anti-English Spectrum itself, which was obviously retrieved from a post on Ranting Englishman, where in the comments they played with the idea of sending it to Anti-English Spectrum. Considering the level of harassment they have given to this and other sites who have supported ATEK, it fits their pattern.

  • Kevin Robinson

    Hey guys, I just want to quickly comment on your AFEK comments in the podcast. I’ve talked with a lot of them, and apart from their stance on ATEK, I’ve found them to be quite nice and good guys and gals. I completely disagree with many of them about ATEK (I’m not the only one I think), so I simply don’t talk about that and avoid that part of the forums.

    Overall, the forums there are about development both professionally and privately. I’ve learned about their families, their experiences with schools or travel, and lots more.

    Basically, I don’t think your comments were completely accurate.

    • http://zenkimchi.com/ Joe

      Well, to be fair, I should have qualified that with “if” they did it then it was low. I got the info from two separate sources, saw the post on Anti-English Spectrum itself, which was obviously retrieved from a post on Ranting Englishman, where in the comments they played with the idea of sending it to Anti-English Spectrum. Considering the level of harassment they have given to this and other sites who have supported ATEK, it fits their pattern.

  • Chae

    As for 90,000 won steak in Korea, I wouldn’t pay that either. Granted, my sole experience with steak in Korea was at Outback (I think) with an impossibly cheerful waitress in 2000 when I ordered my ribeye medium rare, and something resembling shoe leather with some kind of sweet, tangy sauce came out.

    But $70+ steak in the US, I have and will again. Business expensing, I love you.

    As an aside, Costco warehouses in Atlanta area have been selling USDA Prime ribeyes at around $10/lbs. and it is seriously yummy. I have attempted dry aging with their USDA Choice beef with some uneven result. Choice ribeyes is around $7/lbs and tenderloin is around $10/lbs. Go for standing rib roast, and price drops even further.

  • Chae

    As for 90,000 won steak in Korea, I wouldn’t pay that either. Granted, my sole experience with steak in Korea was at Outback (I think) with an impossibly cheerful waitress in 2000 when I ordered my ribeye medium rare, and something resembling shoe leather with some kind of sweet, tangy sauce came out.

    But $70+ steak in the US, I have and will again. Business expensing, I love you.

    As an aside, Costco warehouses in Atlanta area have been selling USDA Prime ribeyes at around $10/lbs. and it is seriously yummy. I have attempted dry aging with their USDA Choice beef with some uneven result. Choice ribeyes is around $7/lbs and tenderloin is around $10/lbs. Go for standing rib roast, and price drops even further.

  • TJ

    Wow! You could not be more fucking wrong about AFEK and what it is about. Which doesn’t really surprise me because a lot of what I’ve heard you say is dripping with ignorance. Love to talk and set the record straight. PM me on Dave’s or contact me by e-mail. Either way.

  • TJ

    Wow! You could not be more fucking wrong about AFEK and what it is about. Which doesn’t really surprise me because a lot of what I’ve heard you say is dripping with ignorance. Love to talk and set the record straight. PM me on Dave’s or contact me by e-mail. Either way.

  • http://zenkimchi.com/ Joe

    Not making any blanket statements about AFEK’s actual members. Yet, as Karl said, the actions of its most vocal members/founders don’t endear themselves well with the general expat community. The person who called me and asked me about AFEK specifically asked if they were the ones behind the trashing of “the ATEK guy.” I told him that it may be a good group in the end, but that the founders were involved in that incident. That was the decision maker for him, and he decided not to join.

    Like I said, the information in Anti-English Spectrum post comes directly from the web site of AFEK’s webmaster. There are comments on the AFEK founder’s web site about doing exactly what I mentioned on the show: sending the information to Anti-English Spectrum. It may have originally been made in jest, but the following comments showed that the vocal members took it seriously.

    If the claims on Mr. Hellmann’s past are true or not, despite having a clean criminal record, it’s not the duty of a self-appointed mob to play prosecutor, judge and jury. And it’s the ultimate betrayal to the community as a whole to send information like that to a group who was founded on its distaste for interracial mixing and has the ear of the media and subsequently legislators.

  • http://www.yonguksaram.com/ Mike Yates

    So much bullshit…

    Karl: “Maybe AFEK would like to disavow their actions? Sorry, they are judged by the worst of their members who remain members in good standing. I see nothing wrong with Joe’s criticism.”

    That would entail AFEK nominating a spokesperson. I guess that would also entail elections and the other crap that comes with it. What then? Advocacy? Campaigning? A ‘mandate’. AFEK has none of these things, and does not want them. Should Mark Zuckerberg make a comment every time somebody who has a facebook account do something he doesn’t agree with?

    Joe “Not making any blanket statements about AFEK’s actual members.”

    Except you did. There are 13 minutes of blanket statements included on this podcast.

    “There are comments on the AFEK founder’s web site about doing exactly what I mentioned on the show: sending the information to Anti-English Spectrum. It may have originally been made in jest, but the following comments showed that the vocal members took it seriously.”

    Why do you assume that the AES post was made by an AFEK member? It was NOT. The follow-up comments were NOT made by members.

    Admit it Joe… you had a nice day out with the Sparkle bunch, had a few too many drinks of the week, and your mouth got detached from your brain. I would hope that is the case anyway… If those comments were made in a Korean newspaper with such disregard for basic fact checking, they would be on Korea Beat and koreamediawatch by now!

    • http://zenkimchi.com/ Joe

      So, what we’re saying is that I found damning evidence on the Internet connecting point A to point B along with getting tipped by two separate sources and made erroneous conclusions?

      Sound familiar?

      Granted, not nearly as bad as claiming that someone who was once involved with gay research was a “sexual deviant.”

      Please don’t paint AFEK as a genteel tea sipping society. If the comments I and others have gotten on our blogs weren’t so constantly bile-ridden, curse-filled and taunting it wouldn’t be so tragically funny.

  • http://www.gokorea.info karl

    1) That the S2 brand uses clearly a nazi image (replacing the swastika with an S2, gee) doesn’t really rescue your position.

    2) AFEK has at least two rather vocal members who have thrown a lot of low blows. Maybe AFEK would like to disavow their actions? Sorry, they are judged by the worst of their members who remain members in good standing. I see nothing wrong with Joe’s criticism. AFEK reminds me of those people who form “white student associations” in response to there being a Chinese student association, a Black student association, etc. They don’t form it because they want to promote aspects of their culture. They just want to form it to “make a point”.

    3) I loved the McDonald’s vid:

  • http://www.gokorea.info karl

    1) That the S2 brand uses clearly a nazi image (replacing the swastika with an S2, gee) doesn’t really rescue your position.

    2) AFEK has at least two rather vocal members who have thrown a lot of low blows. Maybe AFEK would like to disavow their actions? Sorry, they are judged by the worst of their members who remain members in good standing. I see nothing wrong with Joe’s criticism. AFEK reminds me of those people who form “white student associations” in response to there being a Chinese student association, a Black student association, etc. They don’t form it because they want to promote aspects of their culture. They just want to form it to “make a point”.

    3) I loved the McDonald’s vid:

  • TJ

    Why not invite some members of AFEK on your show for an interview?

  • TJ

    Why not invite some members of AFEK on your show for an interview?

  • http://www.yrad.com/cs/ karl

    ||Please don’t paint AFEK as a genteel tea sipping society. If the comments I and others have gotten on our blogs weren’t so constantly bile-ridden, curse-filled and taunting it wouldn’t be so tragically funny.||

    Indeed.

  • http://zenkimchi.com/ Joe

    Not making any blanket statements about AFEK’s actual members. Yet, as Karl said, the actions of its most vocal members/founders don’t endear themselves well with the general expat community. The person who called me and asked me about AFEK specifically asked if they were the ones behind the trashing of “the ATEK guy.” I told him that it may be a good group in the end, but that the founders were involved in that incident. That was the decision maker for him, and he decided not to join.

    Like I said, the information in Anti-English Spectrum post comes directly from the web site of AFEK’s webmaster. There are comments on the AFEK founder’s web site about doing exactly what I mentioned on the show: sending the information to Anti-English Spectrum. It may have originally been made in jest, but the following comments showed that the vocal members took it seriously.

    If the claims on Mr. Hellmann’s past are true or not, despite having a clean criminal record, it’s not the duty of a self-appointed mob to play prosecutor, judge and jury. And it’s the ultimate betrayal to the community as a whole to send information like that to a group who was founded on its distaste for interracial mixing and has the ear of the media and subsequently legislators.

  • Harry

    Joe writes:

    “There are comments on the AFEK founder’s web site about doing exactly what I mentioned on the show: sending the information to Anti-English Spectrum. It may have originally been made in jest, but the following comments showed that the vocal members took it seriously.”

    I visited the website in question and I see ONE post be someone named “Brave Foxtrot.”

    He/she writes:

    June 16th, 2009 at 12:51 am

    “Have you thought about contacting “The citizens’ movement for the expulsion of illegal foreign language teachers’?

    http://cafe.naver.com/englishspectrum

    They have media contacts (even the Chosun Ilbo) and have exposed foreign English teacher drug users, mollesters, and AIDS and STDs patients – I’m sure they would love to get their hands on this.

    Sure, sometimes they end up making all English teachers look bad, but that’s a small price to pay to get revenge on evil ATEK, right?

    On the other hand, if you’ve already sent this to the media, I wouldn’t bother contacting them. They’ll be using this to make all foreign teachers look bad soon enough.”

    After Foxtrot’s comment, I see no further discussion of sending information to Anti-English Spectrum. All the posters ignored that idea.

    So, Joe, I don’t understand why you feel it was AFEK who ratted out Tony to AES? The comment board doesn’t suugest that, does it?

  • Harry

    Joe writes:

    “There are comments on the AFEK founder’s web site about doing exactly what I mentioned on the show: sending the information to Anti-English Spectrum. It may have originally been made in jest, but the following comments showed that the vocal members took it seriously.”

    I visited the website in question and I see ONE post be someone named “Brave Foxtrot.”

    He/she writes:

    June 16th, 2009 at 12:51 am

    “Have you thought about contacting “The citizens’ movement for the expulsion of illegal foreign language teachers’?

    http://cafe.naver.com/englishspectrum

    They have media contacts (even the Chosun Ilbo) and have exposed foreign English teacher drug users, mollesters, and AIDS and STDs patients – I’m sure they would love to get their hands on this.

    Sure, sometimes they end up making all English teachers look bad, but that’s a small price to pay to get revenge on evil ATEK, right?

    On the other hand, if you’ve already sent this to the media, I wouldn’t bother contacting them. They’ll be using this to make all foreign teachers look bad soon enough.”

    After Foxtrot’s comment, I see no further discussion of sending information to Anti-English Spectrum. All the posters ignored that idea.

    So, Joe, I don’t understand why you feel it was AFEK who ratted out Tony to AES? The comment board doesn’t suugest that, does it?

  • http://www.yonguksaram.com/ Mike Yates

    You get the comments on your site because you invite them with your own bile-driven rants. I for one have always tried to remain courteous here, despite the obvious one-sidedness of this board.

    Accusations about AFEK have been thrown around based on no evidence whatsoever. Yeah right… you can complain about the posting I made about your good friend, but when I posted, I provided evidence. You have thrown about unfounded accusations about AFEK based on nothing. And you know why that is? Because you have nothing. AFEK is a website that is open to anybody who qualifies for an account there. Pro-ATEK people post there, and have posted here in defence of AFEK, yet you choose to ignore that.

    As for curse filled… I do no such thing, yet you are obviously referring to me in much of your 13 minute curse filled rant.

    • http://zenkimchi.com/ Joe

      So, it would be a shock to find a post on Anti-English Spectrum six days after you posted the exact same information? The only difference was that Anti-English Spectrum blocked out the personal information that would violate Korea’s libel laws. Your comments, which you approved, included a link to Anti-English Spectrum and a link to all of Hellmann’s colleagues’ email addresses. I’m sure you despise Anti-English Spectrum as much as I do, and I’m definitely sure that you didn’t give them the info. But you gotta admit, not all your commenters (nor mine) are completely stable. That’s why I don’t let personal info get through on my comment boards or anything. I’ve been burned by Korea’s libel laws once, and I barely escaped for posting a lot less damaging stuff than what currently sits on your site. It’s all nicely and neatly packaged for someone out for revenge to do so.

      Even if this is true about Tony, and I’ll admit you make a compelling case, it’s not about defending Tony. Personally, the jury’s still out on my end about his background.

      What upsets me is that no matter how much I hated someone, I would never do that to a person. Destroying lives–I just don’t understand the joy in that.

      Yet even worse, that one piece with the following comments handed a gift to the organization that was founded out of disgust that people like you and I would date, marry and reproduce interracially.

      If you follow what Matt (GoPF) and Ben Wagner have found (Ben through personally interviewing the government people involved) the addition of the AIDS test in the visa rules was based on news stories that used Anti-English Spectrum as their source. The laws that are being pushed through now to tighten immigration across the board, not including whitey spouses (yet) but other spouses of Korean nationals are justified by what they have read in the media. Wagner asked them where they got their info, and they cited stories that were straight out of Anti-English Spectrum propaganda.

      Instead of countering it, our own community is feeding them more stuff to use against us. It’s maddening!

      Mike, why do we have to fight?

      The enemy is Anti-English Spectrum, not ATEK, not ZenKimchi, not the SeoulPodcast, not even Tony-frakkin-Hellmann.

      Honestly, AFEK’s not my enemy either.

      I’m willing to give AFEK the benefit of the doubt. Hell, I’m willing to retract everything I said and apologize on the show and pull you in as a panelist so you can rip me a new one. We need to be more responsible and stop damaging the community. As we can see from the xenophobic onslaught this month in the media, the economic downturn is going to create scapegoats out of the vulnerable–and history has continually proven that the foreigners are right there in the front of the firing line. I’m not counting on the pattern to be any different this time.

      Who is countering this propaganda?

      It should be you. It should be me. It should be all of us!

      While we are having a stupid little war of AFEK vs. ATEK or whatever, a little intern at the Chosun Ilbo has deftly been killing any positive image we had left. Lawmakers have their ears on the media, and the media has their ears on people like Anti-English Spectrum. Instead of fighting each other, we should be using this energy to work together. We’re obviously seeing that ignoring these racists or just plainly ranting on our blogs doesn’t make them go away.

  • http://www.yonguksaram.com/ Mike Yates

    So much bullshit…

    Karl: “Maybe AFEK would like to disavow their actions? Sorry, they are judged by the worst of their members who remain members in good standing. I see nothing wrong with Joe’s criticism.”

    That would entail AFEK nominating a spokesperson. I guess that would also entail elections and the other crap that comes with it. What then? Advocacy? Campaigning? A ‘mandate’. AFEK has none of these things, and does not want them. Should Mark Zuckerberg make a comment every time somebody who has a facebook account do something he doesn’t agree with?

    Joe “Not making any blanket statements about AFEK’s actual members.”

    Except you did. There are 13 minutes of blanket statements included on this podcast.

    “There are comments on the AFEK founder’s web site about doing exactly what I mentioned on the show: sending the information to Anti-English Spectrum. It may have originally been made in jest, but the following comments showed that the vocal members took it seriously.”

    Why do you assume that the AES post was made by an AFEK member? It was NOT. The follow-up comments were NOT made by members.

    Admit it Joe… you had a nice day out with the Sparkle bunch, had a few too many drinks of the week, and your mouth got detached from your brain. I would hope that is the case anyway… If those comments were made in a Korean newspaper with such disregard for basic fact checking, they would be on Korea Beat and koreamediawatch by now!

    • http://zenkimchi.com/ Joe

      So, what we’re saying is that I found damning evidence on the Internet connecting point A to point B along with getting tipped by two separate sources and made erroneous conclusions?

      Sound familiar?

      Granted, not nearly as bad as claiming that someone who was once involved with gay research was a “sexual deviant.”

      Please don’t paint AFEK as a genteel tea sipping society. If the comments I and others have gotten on our blogs weren’t so constantly bile-ridden, curse-filled and taunting it wouldn’t be so tragically funny.

  • http://www.yrad.com/cs/ karl

    http://jenniferteacher.blogspot.com/2007/11/dancing-girls-and-wedding-halls-two.html

    Jennifer’s wedding video, which I think she referred to in this podcast.

  • http://www.yrad.com/cs/ karl

    ||Please don’t paint AFEK as a genteel tea sipping society. If the comments I and others have gotten on our blogs weren’t so constantly bile-ridden, curse-filled and taunting it wouldn’t be so tragically funny.||

    Indeed.

  • Janice

    “Please don’t paint AFEK as a genteel tea sipping society. If the comments I and others have gotten on our blogs weren’t so constantly bile-ridden, curse-filled and taunting it wouldn’t be so tragically funny.”

    Comments from who? Please be more specific.

  • Janice

    “Please don’t paint AFEK as a genteel tea sipping society. If the comments I and others have gotten on our blogs weren’t so constantly bile-ridden, curse-filled and taunting it wouldn’t be so tragically funny.”

    Comments from who? Please be more specific.

  • http://www.yonguksaram.com/ Mike Yates

    You get the comments on your site because you invite them with your own bile-driven rants. I for one have always tried to remain courteous here, despite the obvious one-sidedness of this board.

    Accusations about AFEK have been thrown around based on no evidence whatsoever. Yeah right… you can complain about the posting I made about your good friend, but when I posted, I provided evidence. You have thrown about unfounded accusations about AFEK based on nothing. And you know why that is? Because you have nothing. AFEK is a website that is open to anybody who qualifies for an account there. Pro-ATEK people post there, and have posted here in defence of AFEK, yet you choose to ignore that.

    As for curse filled… I do no such thing, yet you are obviously referring to me in much of your 13 minute curse filled rant.

    • http://zenkimchi.com/ Joe

      So, it would be a shock to find a post on Anti-English Spectrum six days after you posted the exact same information? The only difference was that Anti-English Spectrum blocked out the personal information that would violate Korea’s libel laws. Your comments, which you approved, included a link to Anti-English Spectrum and a link to all of Hellmann’s colleagues’ email addresses. I’m sure you despise Anti-English Spectrum as much as I do, and I’m definitely sure that you didn’t give them the info. But you gotta admit, not all your commenters (nor mine) are completely stable. That’s why I don’t let personal info get through on my comment boards or anything. I’ve been burned by Korea’s libel laws once, and I barely escaped for posting a lot less damaging stuff than what currently sits on your site. It’s all nicely and neatly packaged for someone out for revenge to do so.

      Even if this is true about Tony, and I’ll admit you make a compelling case, it’s not about defending Tony. Personally, the jury’s still out on my end about his background.

      What upsets me is that no matter how much I hated someone, I would never do that to a person. Destroying lives–I just don’t understand the joy in that.

      Yet even worse, that one piece with the following comments handed a gift to the organization that was founded out of disgust that people like you and I would date, marry and reproduce interracially.

      If you follow what Matt (GoPF) and Ben Wagner have found (Ben through personally interviewing the government people involved) the addition of the AIDS test in the visa rules was based on news stories that used Anti-English Spectrum as their source. The laws that are being pushed through now to tighten immigration across the board, not including whitey spouses (yet) but other spouses of Korean nationals are justified by what they have read in the media. Wagner asked them where they got their info, and they cited stories that were straight out of Anti-English Spectrum propaganda.

      Instead of countering it, our own community is feeding them more stuff to use against us. It’s maddening!

      Mike, why do we have to fight?

      The enemy is Anti-English Spectrum, not ATEK, not ZenKimchi, not the SeoulPodcast, not even Tony-frakkin-Hellmann.

      Honestly, AFEK’s not my enemy either.

      I’m willing to give AFEK the benefit of the doubt. Hell, I’m willing to retract everything I said and apologize on the show and pull you in as a panelist so you can rip me a new one. We need to be more responsible and stop damaging the community. As we can see from the xenophobic onslaught this month in the media, the economic downturn is going to create scapegoats out of the vulnerable–and history has continually proven that the foreigners are right there in the front of the firing line. I’m not counting on the pattern to be any different this time.

      Who is countering this propaganda?

      It should be you. It should be me. It should be all of us!

      While we are having a stupid little war of AFEK vs. ATEK or whatever, a little intern at the Chosun Ilbo has deftly been killing any positive image we had left. Lawmakers have their ears on the media, and the media has their ears on people like Anti-English Spectrum. Instead of fighting each other, we should be using this energy to work together. We’re obviously seeing that ignoring these racists or just plainly ranting on our blogs doesn’t make them go away.

  • Ian

    Ohhh… Such drama! I guess I have to listen to more of this podcast (have about 1 hour left). With all of the BS that has been going on this week in the foreign community, do we really have to argue about this? Really? We should focus a little more on the issues that are really going to hurt our families: all these crazy articles popping up in the Chosun Ilbo.

  • Ian

    Ohhh… Such drama! I guess I have to listen to more of this podcast (have about 1 hour left). With all of the BS that has been going on this week in the foreign community, do we really have to argue about this? Really? We should focus a little more on the issues that are really going to hurt our families: all these crazy articles popping up in the Chosun Ilbo.

  • http://www.yrad.com/cs/ karl

    http://jenniferteacher.blogspot.com/2007/11/dancing-girls-and-wedding-halls-two.html

    Jennifer’s wedding video, which I think she referred to in this podcast.

  • http://stafford.squarespace.com Stafford

    First….Oh no….wait….Arrrrrgh!

  • http://stafford.squarespace.com Stafford

    First….Oh no….wait….Arrrrrgh!

  • http://stafford.squarespace.com Stafford

    So from all this I take it everyone found Martina and Simon to be real cool and interesting guests.

  • http://stafford.squarespace.com Stafford

    So from all this I take it everyone found Martina and Simon to be real cool and interesting guests.

  • Ian

    Who…?

    Just kidding :D They were great guests! I hope that they come on again soon.

  • Ian

    Who…?

    Just kidding :D They were great guests! I hope that they come on again soon.

  • http://www.gokorea.info karl

    Best line from the show:

    Joe is talking about holding hands with a Korean male friend.

    Joe: It wasn’t gay.

    Jennifer: (cuts in ) Keep talking. We’ll tell you whether or not it was gay.

  • http://www.gokorea.info karl

    Best line from the show:

    Joe is talking about holding hands with a Korean male friend.

    Joe: It wasn’t gay.

    Jennifer: (cuts in ) Keep talking. We’ll tell you whether or not it was gay.

  • juicius

    Yeah, I think this was one of the better shows and I thoroughly enjoyed it. I even went to the guests’ website, something I rarely do.

    As for ATEK, AFEK, Tony stuff. I think some people are learning a valuable lesson that free-wheeling internet flaming doesn’t always transfer to real life where there can be actual consequences for unchecked vitriol, especially in Korea.

    I actually see a lot more objectionable and deplorable comments on US boards, especially on matters that have to do with politics and immigration, so as much as some of you find Korean bloggers to be racist, reactionary, and just plain mean-spirited, you’ll find just the same or worse on the other side of the Pacific, except in the US, of course, you guys won’t be the target of it.

  • juicius

    Yeah, I think this was one of the better shows and I thoroughly enjoyed it. I even went to the guests’ website, something I rarely do.

    As for ATEK, AFEK, Tony stuff. I think some people are learning a valuable lesson that free-wheeling internet flaming doesn’t always transfer to real life where there can be actual consequences for unchecked vitriol, especially in Korea.

    I actually see a lot more objectionable and deplorable comments on US boards, especially on matters that have to do with politics and immigration, so as much as some of you find Korean bloggers to be racist, reactionary, and just plain mean-spirited, you’ll find just the same or worse on the other side of the Pacific, except in the US, of course, you guys won’t be the target of it.

  • http://www.eatyourkimchi.com Simon

    After having read all of the arguments, I have come to the conclusion that Spudgy is still the most badass dog in all of Korea.

    On a sidenote about Spudgy: he almost wasn’t named Spudgy. I really wanted to name him Chodum. Imagine how funny it would be to say “Here Chodum! Come here Chodum! Oh who’s my little Chodum yes you are!”

  • http://www.eatyourkimchi.com Simon

    After having read all of the arguments, I have come to the conclusion that Spudgy is still the most badass dog in all of Korea.

    On a sidenote about Spudgy: he almost wasn’t named Spudgy. I really wanted to name him Chodum. Imagine how funny it would be to say “Here Chodum! Come here Chodum! Oh who’s my little Chodum yes you are!”

  • http://jenniferteacher.blogspot.com Good Jen

    Karl, thanks for going to the trouble to find and post the link. I love this video (there are three I have posted somewhere on my blog– not sure if there are more.) I, of course, can take no credit for them– the dancing girls one was going around the interwebs and I, being ever-so-slightly OCD, found a couple more from the same fantabulous wedding extravaganza. So, if that one vid is not enough… if you need more cowbell… then check my previous and subsequent posts, because at least one will have more.

  • http://jenniferteacher.blogspot.com Good Jen

    Karl, thanks for going to the trouble to find and post the link. I love this video (there are three I have posted somewhere on my blog– not sure if there are more.) I, of course, can take no credit for them– the dancing girls one was going around the interwebs and I, being ever-so-slightly OCD, found a couple more from the same fantabulous wedding extravaganza. So, if that one vid is not enough… if you need more cowbell… then check my previous and subsequent posts, because at least one will have more.

  • Ian

    Hey, Joe! Did Mike ever take you up on the offer to appear on the show? That could be a pretty interesting podcast.

  • Ian

    Hey, Joe! Did Mike ever take you up on the offer to appear on the show? That could be a pretty interesting podcast.

  • http://twitter.com/donburi Don C

    Good to hear some fellow UofT kids!

    Anyway, about street food, I am also of the mind that what doesn’t kill you only makes you stronger. Also, coming from Toronto – the land of hot dogs – from my perspective, Korea has a lot of great street food.

  • http://twitter.com/donburi Don C

    Good to hear some fellow UofT kids!

    Anyway, about street food, I am also of the mind that what doesn’t kill you only makes you stronger. Also, coming from Toronto – the land of hot dogs – from my perspective, Korea has a lot of great street food.